Having posted a few each way bets lately myself I thought it may be a worthwhile exercise to look a little deeper into these bets and to see if there are any ways to improve the success rate overall or whether ditching the bet as a waste of time would be better.
To those who don’t know, an each way bet means placing two equal bets on one horse. The first stake is on the horse winning the race and the second stake is on the horse being ‘placed’.
The norm for being placed is when your horse finishes second or third but there are some variations depending on how many horses are in the race and what type of race you are betting in, a handicap or a non handicap.
If you do get placed you win a fraction of the odds back which will either be one fifth of the odds or one quarter and the table below shows all race types and winning place money.
Non Handicap Races
- 2 – 4 runners, win only no place.
- 5 – 7 runners, two places and 1/4 the odds.
- 8+ runners, three places and 1/5 the odds.
Handicap Races
- 2 – 4 runners, win only no place.
- 5 – 7 runners, two places and 1/4 the odds.
- 8 – 11 runners, three places and 1/5 the odds.
- 12 – 15 runners, three places and 1/4 the odds.
- 16+ runners, four places and 1/4 the odds.
It should be noted that these are the terms when placing a bet at a bookmakers or online bookmakers and not at the course as the same rules do not apply.
These rules also do not apply when betting on the exchanges as the place odds are not set here as they are with the Bookmakers.
You can often get five places in big field handicaps on big race days and whilst most major Bookmakers will all be making the same offer, it is worth checking that yours will be doing so.
Why Place An Each Way Bet?
Most people place an each way bet rather than a win bet because a) they don’t think their horse is definitely going to win or b) the price they are taking is 10/1 or bigger.
Often the bet will be placed without considering exactly what it is you are doing and I can be as guilty of this as anyone else. After all, you are placing two stakes on the horse and one of these is only going to get your stake back in most cases, and just a little profit at other times.
So if you are putting one stake on something that at best is going to get your stake back, why bother in the first place?
And if you are staking so much because you aren’t 100% sure that the horse is going to win, I ask again why place the bet in the first place?
The each way bet is sometimes called an insurance bet and rather like everyday insurance, it doesn’t seem to offer great value or pay out very often.
Race Type And Odds
The type of race that you are betting in and the odds that you take will determine how much you get back if your horse is placed yet some people think that betting at big odds means that you are making a worthwhile profit IF the horse can finish in the places, but of course as the odds get bigger, the less chance the horse has of winning or placing.
So take odds of 20/1 for example in an eight runner handicap race where you are paid 1/5 the odds for just finishing second or third.
4/1 seems good odds for just having to beat five others into third, you have done your homework on the race and think the horse is ‘good each way value’.
However if the horse does only finish second or third you are actually only getting 2/1, as for a £1 each way bet returns £4 for the place and you have staked £2 on the bet in total, so it is the same as betting £2 at 2/1.
And when you look at it like that, only getting 2/1 when the chances of a 20/1 shot getting placed in an eight runner race are about 15 in every 100 races, it starts to look like very poor value indeed.
Of course you are hoping that the horse will win at 20/1 but that is only going to happen on average about 3 or 4 times in every 100 races.
Looking at 8/1 shots in the same way only pays the equivalent of 4/5 if the horse is only placed and just Even money if you are betting on a 10/1 shot and the chances of these two being placed are still only around 28 times in every 100 races.
Obviously we know the odds are against us and we are trying to beat the stats by carefully selecting just those 20/1, 10/1, 8/1 or whatever odds horses that we have decided have a better chance than average and not just betting on every horse at those prices, where we clearly would end up giving our money away.
The Bookmakers Overround
You may have heard of the overround, a percentage figure that the Bookmakers work to that ensures they make money over the long term, as long as they take the correct amount of bets given the winning percentage of each horses odds in the race.
Anything over 100% and the Bookmaker is okay, in fact they work to about 110% to 115% on average, with big races like last weeks Cesarewitch, thirty four runner handicap, working to a huge 146%. Meaning if things had worked out perfectly they would have taken a 46% profit on all stakes taken for the race.
Well there is an overround figure for the place market too, which also works in their favour because of how the winning odds are set.
To ensure a profit on all each way bets they must make 100 multiplied by the number of places they are paying out to for all of the place odds as a percentage.
So if paying two places they need over 200%, for three places over 300%.
To work out the percentage you divide 100 by the decimal odds. So 3/1 is 4.0 as a decimal price and 100/4 equals 25, so a 3/1 shot has a theoretical 25% of winning a race.
Same for the places and the 20/1 horse earlier at 4/1 (5.0) for the place is, 100/5 equals 20%, much less than the actual figure of around 28% for which this actually happens in reality.
Best Races For The Each Way Bet
If you look at the odds and the place market overround, then there are a few races that don’t actually give you an edge but do allow the Bookmakers to not win as much statistically as other races.
These races where the Bookmaker has less than a 10% edge, compared to over 20% in some other races, are all 8 runner races and handicap races with between 12 and 16 runners.
So if you do want to place an each way bet, you may want to look at these as you have more of a chance against the Bookmakers and the way the percentages are set up.
A 16 runner handicap gives you the best edge of all of these but finding exactly 16 runners in a handicap these days is not that easy, the same as a dead 8 too, however there will be plenty of handicap races with between 12 and 15 runners that you may want to exploit.
The worst races you can place a bet in are non handicaps races of 12 runners or over.
Is There Any Good News?
Well you can now say that you know the races to look at to get the best out of any each way bets but is there any way to increase your chances with this bet?
Well I think first of all I would ask myself is it really worth placing an each way bet at all. After all you are placing two stakes on a horse and one of these is only getting a small percentage of the odds back in the first place and that is if the horse can mange to finish in the first three, which we know is not as easy as it would seem.
First of all I would say you should probably only bet each way on a horse that you really think has a chance of WINNING the race. You are wasting at least one stake, if not two, just thinking or hoping the horse may fall into a place.
I think it is down to fear of losing that we play the each way bet so often and just getting all or half your stake back on some races does feel like you are not on a losing run.
Clearly betting 20/1 shots all of the time is going to mean quite a few, long losing runs throughout the year and by betting each way we think that just getting a small percentage of places will at least make us feel we are not losing all of the time.
There are options of course and whilst I am not going to suggest putting both stakes on the win, unless you normally split your stakes for an each way bet, you could back two horses in a race instead.
To me this is a far better idea as apart from losing one stake for sure, you are getting the full winning odds when you win and not some small fifth or quarter that the generous Bookmakers offer us.
I read a long time ago about a psychiatrist that treated those with a gambling habit. He suggested that these people didn’t always just have an addiction to gambling, it was the losing that caused them much of the problems which led to chasing losses and increasing stakes etc..
So he suggested that for every bet they placed, they put another bet on the favourite, meaning that they would at least back a winner approximately thirty percent of the time.
Maybe this is an idea you could adopt, if not backing the favourite then perhaps the second favourite each time, along with your own carefully researched selection.
I have also read about putting one stake on the place and two on the win, which will make less profit for the place but means you win more when the selections does come first and is something you may want to look into.
Jockeyship
What I have found which is as important a factor when betting each way, is that a jockey will not always pull out all the stops, once he knows he is beaten.
For example, a jockey that leads into the final furlong and is challenged 100 yards out, will be giving it his all to either win or come a close second.
The same jockey who is headed over a furlong out will not be putting in the same effort to try and get into third place, just so that you can win some of your each way bet, as he knows the horse is beaten. Similarly, a jockey who has never got into the race, will only go through the motions of pushing the horse out and will try and save it for next time, despite riding to the rules.
Watch a jockey riding the second horse who is challenging for the lead in the last 100 yards of the Derby for example, compared to a jockey in a run of the mill handicap who has just lost the lead and is being swamped by the other horses.
It is natural to be going hell for leather when you really feel you have a chance compared to when the race is over and I think you should take this into consideration when thinking about the each way bet.
The Failed Each Way Steal
You may have heard of the supposed ‘Each Way Steal’, betting each way in small fields against an odds on favourite, but however you look at it, you are still getting the same 2/1 place price for a 20/1 shot, or Evens for a 10/1 shot in these races and I have never understood why people seem to think so much of this idea.
Being a system addict, I have looked into hundreds of these races to try and find out which is the best horse to bet each way against the odds on shot but I have never come up with anything concrete.
The odds on shot wins at least 50% of the time and there is nothing to suggest that the second favourite is worth playing, either to win or each way, in fact if anything I would suggest laying the second favourite is probably the best long term angle.
The Opposite To ‘The Steal’
If you are an each way player then I think the best races to bet in are what would be the opposite of the each way steal and those would be races where the favourite is quite a big price, say 7/2 or 4/1.
If you only then bet in the suggested races, i.e. dead 8 runner races, or handicaps with between 12 and 16 runners and the favourite is 4/1 or bigger, then you can say that the race is probably quite an open race and almost ‘anything may happen’.
Maybe find the three races on the day with the biggest forecast favourites compared to field size, (8 to 16 runners) and just concentrate on them when looking for your each way bet.
Divide the number of runners by the forecast favourite price and choose the lowest three on the day. E.g An 8 runner race divided by a 2/1 favourite would be 4.0, an 11 runner race with a 4/1 favourite would be 2.75.
Looking At The Run Style
As I said earlier, jockeys will put in less effort when they know they cannot win and don’t always ride as hard to only get third and probably finish down the field, giving the horse an easier time, saving it for the next race.
Two ways you may find better each way bets are by looking at the horses run styles for a race. For details on the Inform Racing run styles, read this post about front runners here, or read the full user guide for an explanation here.
If you can find one horse in a race that will want to take the lead and go on, then the horse may be able to get the lead and hold on to at least second or third places, even if it cannot win.
Similarly, a horse that is usually held up for a late run, in a race full of front runners, will get the race run to suit his running style and will very likely be able to run through the tiring horses and at least stay on for a place.
See my post on Thatcherite in the 5.50 Redcar who won using this hold up run style recently here.
Find something you fancy, that you feel has a good chance of winning and with a lone run style that will be suited by the race; in an 8 runner, or 12 to 16 runner handicap and you will surely improve the strike rate from your each way bets.
Hi Ian I like EW betting but to get good returns you need to multiply the bets with a lot of horses on one bet full cover is a no no the bet I like is the Union Jack EW AT 10P £1.60 had some very big win’s and places had a 10p ew on the 9 one day 8 were placed had £840 place money on the 9th horse and it came in 5th but still picked up £16 .50p in place trebles I think it’s the only bet that has more horses than bet’s i.e. 9 horses 8 bets using it with Normans system at the moment
Not a bad summary. I understand why people bet each way as a lot feel it is a safety net and reduces variance, conveniently forgetting that it is as you say a 2 part bet.
I could write paragraphs on this especially where the bookmakers overrounds are so mathematically against you in the place part of the bet(better value in the betfair place market if you are that way inclinedbut only in certain field sizes).
Suffice to say that betting each way in races where there are 2 places, the shape of the market not withstanding, it is very much against you, and also in those 12-15 runner hcps where 3 places are on offer. The odds against you in the place market are hard to beat.
I like EW betting and this post has given me food for thought. I usually look for 14/1 plus chances and trainers who have travelled. e.g Goldie send horses south to Doncaster or York. Also, potential ew chances must hace recent form or have dropped in grade. My other system for EW bets is to look for horses at 3/1 and above that have a good chance of winning the race. Then select the best two and have two win singles and an ew double. One win or two places gets your money back and a small profit two winners can pay handsomely.
Hi James,
I do enjoy reading your articles.
I can’t see the early maths here mate, maybe it’s me.lol. Correct me if I’m wrong.
At 20-1 and 1/5th odds you correctly say 4-1 for the place but then say it’s only 2-1 really because you staked £1 ew.
A £1 ew bet @ 20-1 (8 runner H’cap) returns £5 at 4-1 for the place ie. £1X4= £4 plus winning stake £1 for the place part of the bet(not £4 return) so a profit of £3 on the bet or in effect the return is 3-1 (not 2-1)
If I am wrong please feel free to correct me.
Interestingly in handicaps I prefer myself not to bet each way but to bet on two selections as certain races usually make this profitable and checking Ian’s cards (been with Inform since 2008) I can be quite profitable when conditions are right.
Not betting when conditions are not right is the secret and we never learn that one do we?lol.
I myself usually bet each way when taking on an odds on shot with something else in non H’caps and particularly in maiden. The reasons for this are obvious and as I never bet odds on for a win and I always look to take on the odds on fav, it’s a great way to shorten your losses.
Just to clarify, I don’t always bet against every odds on fav just when I think I have a good reason to oppose him.
Be interested to know what you think of this idea James.
Cheers all.
Gary
Hi Gary, yes sorry, I am easily confused with the mathematics of a bet especially when trying to get the post out in a hurry! I was looking at £2 out and £4 back but it is really £2 out, £5 return so a £3 profit and 3/1 not 2/1.
Mind you I didn’t need to work any maths out on my Rusty Rocket each way bet this afternoon. The typical each way bet coming in 5th of 16 at 33/1. That’s £0 back however you look at it 🙁
Regards your each way plan I can see the reasoning of course if you can find a reason for opposing a shorty. However non handicaps do not have the best terms for each way betting, but if you feel you have an edge then you know the risks and bet accordingly.
In fact the return is effectively 6/4 – you have bet £2 (£1ew) for a return of £5.
I think there’s a definite edge in backing each way in 16+ runner handicaps. Theoretically, consider a race with 17 runners, each with the same chance and no overround. They’re all at 16-1 in the betting. I know this is unrealistic but it shows the point.
2 pts win on each horse costs 34 points and returns 34 points (the winner at 16-1). Profit = 0.
1 pt each way on each horse costs 34 points and returns 37 points (the winner at 16-1 and four places at 4-1).
Of course with the bookie’s overround the returns are scaled down, but the each way return will be greater than the win only return in this case.
For a normal market, the horses closer to the front of the market give even more of a mathematical edge than the outsiders. So you are better off betting each way at the shorter prices in each-way-friendly races and bet win only at the bigger prices.
I think you are right with the 16 runner handicaps and those at the head of the market as I believe the first five or so in the betting do win as many in big fields as they do in smaller ones. May be worth looking at the odds in the ‘5 to be placed’ market on Betfair just to get that extra place but all depends on the odds of the horse you are backing.
Spot on Kevin!
hi James
great article and love the spread sheet.I am somewhat baffled htough by the maths of bet comparison
as suggested by Gary. If you have £ 1 ew @20/1 1/5 odds a place your return is £5.Total stake
is £2- the win £3.So surely the comparative odds are 6/4? as 2£ at those odds yields the same return.
keep up the good work
eric
Sorry to say that your both very wrong on your odds for getting a 20/1 shot placed at 1/5th odds. You are correct that the return is £5 but equate that to a stake of £2 and the odds are quite clearly 6/4!
You laid out 2 to win 3 that is 1.5/1 or 6/4.
I missed his post but Eric is quite clearly correct.
Yes but you get half your stake back so you only laid out £1 not 2 so £5 return equals £4 profit minus the £1 lost equals £3 or 3-1
An ew bet is actually 2 bets in this example £1 ew you risk losing £2 but in the example you only lost £1 because the place bet was successful.
Gary I dont want to argue but you quite clearly staked 2 and returned 5 at 1/5th the odds so you win 3 for a 2 stake which equals 1.5/1 or 6/4, the fact that your stake was returned doesnt come into it as the total return was 5pts.
I have a software program [no longer exist to buy] that allows me to do every race possible but were it can shine is in 16+ runner HANDICAPS races and I use the actual software in a non handicap way for these races and after putting in all the ratings I use it comes up WITH 4 SELECTIONS ONLY and around 4 out of ten races finds the winner but in some races also finds the 2nd and 3rd. This may sound a stupid way of doing things but the amount of winners found in double figures through out the 2015 turf season
As of the 4th OCTOBER around 115 races had been put through the software and 45 had found the winner but this relates to an outlay of around 460 bets but average sp 12.7pts returns 616 which is a decent profit 156pts. The SOFTWARE gives the 4 selections in order of preference and theirs no doubt the 1st and 2nd rated have the most winners and the top rated alone would have shown 86 pts profit
After saying all that over the past 3 week its found 3 races with the W 2ND AND 3RD
24/9/2015
W 25/1 T/R
2ND 7/2 JT 3RD
3RD 4/1 2ND RATED
30/9/2015
W 40/1 4TH R
2ND 8/1 T/R
3RD 14/1 3RD RATED
F/C 316 EX 954 TRI 4877
9/10/2015
W 14/1 2ND R
2ND 14/1 T/R
3RD 15/2 3/R
The clue in my mind is to look for consistent rated horse [r/p ratings] and ignore those with poor lto ratings and it will make you look at these races in different ways I can assure you.
Also surely if you are having a bet you want it to WIN and instead of backing ew may backing more than 1 to WIN is a better option.
T
I like the idea of getting a few winners in these races Gary, especially when they are 25/1 and 40/1, I am imagining the Betfair prices for these. Plus a few that also place covers a lot of losers.
If you can tell me, what is the software called and if not, what does it actually do to find these selections, do you know?
I may be able to get something set up to do the same.
I prefer to keep it to myself and a few close friends but its possible to find 4 selections a race that would have a better chance of winning by just viewing the r/post ratings than most of the field [not all races]. It must be said the 40/1 shot as been the highest but plenty 16/1 and above. It gives me lbs in but by doing it as a none handicap race their maybe just 3lb between the 4 but in reality that should be the case if the handicappers got his own view of the race right. Avoid horses with poor LTO ratings as very few of them get in the hunt.
I just wanted to show what was possible but although many were PLACED as well win only bets are a lot better in my mind unless 1 wishes to do place only bets on betfair . I presume you was talking about my post not Gary’s and if that was not the case ignore this message.
T
ive been betting a long time,and my approach to each way betting has always been the same,if i can get 2/1 about a place,i bet each way so if the horse places i have a 50% profit
My conclusion is this: If you make good money in the win market, you will make money in the place market.
Eg. 20% roi in the win market = 5% roi in the place market, which is better than nothing.
The biggest mistake most people is do is put 1 point on win bets and 0.5 points e/w. I put 0.8 points e/w on longshots to roughly match the winnings of 1pt win bets. E.g. a 14/1 shot pays €140 as a 1pt win bet or €134.4/140 as a 0.8pt e/w bet at 1/5 and 1/4 odds respectively. This way I have both good profits and acceptable variance.
Just this week I had 26/1, 21/1 and 50/1 shots finish second by a nose, a neck and 3/4 length. Needless to say I made good money on those places instead of throwing 3 points away and tearing my hair out.
Found this on MSN and I’m happy I did. Well written article.